Nick Robinson’s Daughter Discusses Persistent Safety Concerns When Out After Dark

The remark by actress Saoirse Ronan on The Graham Norton Show, “That’s what girls have to think about all of the time,” made in reply to male actors jesting about using a phone as a weapon, has sparked discussions concerning women’s safety and the limited understanding men possess regarding it. This exchange led Nick Robinson, presenter of BBC Radio 4’s Today programme, to interview his daughter, Alice, a teacher in her late twenties, regarding the frequency with which she experiences feelings of unsafety. An edited transcript of their conversation, which was broadcast on Friday, is provided below. Alice expressed that many women likely felt the discussion articulated an issue they had been highlighting for an extended period. She noted it was positive to witness an instance of what she termed, “I could use the word male ignorance, but I don’t mean that derogatorily, you just don’t know about something if you don’t have to experience it all the time,” being acknowledged and promptly challenged with commendation. She stated that she consistently holds her phone and has frequently considered it as a potential weapon. Alice mentioned that she and her father had previously discussed her safety measures five years prior, particularly following the Sarah Everard case. She recalled a walk they took together shortly after lockdown concluded, when people were returning to the streets, necessitating a re-evaluation of personal safety protocols. During their conversation about this, her father expressed considerable shock. Another point raised was the issue of people staring in public. Alice explained that men stare at women in a manner that causes significant discomfort, yet they typically do not do so in the presence of other men. This contributes to a broader situation where men who do not engage in such behavior remain unaware of its prevalence. Alice emphasized that women across all generations are perpetually concerned with personal safety. She noted it is not exclusive to her generation, citing her mother’s frequent discussions with friends and her partner’s mother’s similar considerations. She added that everyone employs diverse strategies, and the most draining aspect is determining the most suitable approach, as many strategies conflict. As an illustration, she recounted an incident this Monday when she was on the top deck, front seats of a double-decker bus. A man stood behind her on the stairs despite numerous available seats, which she found unusual. Passengers had to maneuver past him to board and alight. Subsequently, he sat next to her, and although she acknowledged it might not seem significant, his prior behavior had already indicated he was out of the ordinary, causing her to feel incredibly uncomfortable. She described two common strategies women consider in such situations: first, leaving the seat and getting off the bus immediately, as her stop was next, but this risks the man knowing her destination and potentially following her. The second strategy involves remaining in the seat for as long as possible, accepting physical vulnerability on the bus, then quickly exiting at her stop to prevent being followed, which, however, prolongs her vulnerability on the bus. She questioned how to balance these conflicting options and determine the correct course of action. Alice stated she closed Google Maps on her phone to conceal her destination and ultimately disembarked because she did not feel safe sitting beside him. Upon observing the bus as it departed, she noted he had relocated to a different seat, leading her to conclude he was “definitely following me.” She affirmed that she feels unsafe “Every time I go out in the dark. Any time.” Alice suggested that placing keys between one’s fingers is a common practice for self-defense, allowing one to potentially scrape an attacker’s face. However, she highlighted the contradiction that this action could make keys vulnerable to being taken, potentially revealing one’s home address. Other strategies include feigning a phone conversation, stating “I will be there in 10 minutes, I’m looking forward,” and occasionally mentioning male names to imply that men who “could I guess theoretically beat them up” are expected to arrive. She also mentioned that her friend has access to her phone’s location tracking to monitor her whereabouts. Alice described a dilemma regarding headphones: sometimes avoiding them in the dark is safer for situational awareness, but at other times, she intentionally wears them to deter unwanted interactions, noting that catcalling is more frequent without them. This necessitates determining the safest option based on the specific situation and location. She characterized these behaviors as learned, involving constant vigilance and checking over one’s shoulder. There is a perceived pressure to make the correct decision, as “if something goes wrong, people will ask you what you did.” She highlighted a prevalent culture of victim-blaming, exemplified by the phrase, “well, she was on her own late at night, so what do you expect to happen,” which she seeks to avoid. Nick Robinson recalled his surprise and shock during their post-lockdown conversation, particularly regarding the extensive thought Alice dedicates to personal safety, a topic he believes she frequently discusses with her women friends. He expressed continued shock at the frequency of these concerns, even upon hearing them a second time. While acknowledging that men also consider their safety in specific situations—such as dark streets or alleyways where he might feel wary, cross the road, or avoid certain individuals, making similar calculations—he noted that this occurs “nothing like as often as you obviously do.” He conveyed his dismay that she must contemplate these issues so frequently. Nick Robinson concluded that his key takeaway from the discussion, as an “older man,” is the significant need for continued listening and learning. The complete discussion is available for listening on BBC Sounds. Copyright 2024 BBC. All rights reserved. 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